I think all of us are on the same page regarding welcoming any projects and developers to the IC!
What motivated most people here to speak up was the upcoming SNS sale in the post title. Therefore, I don’t think the criticism here is unfair or unwarranted.
I agree 100% with you this is probably a communication barrier thing.
Herbert, maybe you can help communicate DFINITY’s vision on what the SNS is for, and when a project is ready to SNS to the IC Asia community?
Right now, this forum is full of SNS project announcements all over, with each project having over 1yr of being public on the IC - all are getting their due diligence and constructive criticism (like any company that fundraises or IPOs).
If you are a project that wants to announce an upcoming SNS - the community will do their DD on you.
If you don’t want that level of scrutiny or aren’t ready for it - there’s no pressure to SNS. On ICP, anyone can launch their own token and project without an SNS!
Based on the opinions of the community, I think the foundation should abstain again this time and leave it to users to vote.I have the same problem as Sonic.
We are inviting experienced developers to test EMC network. To ensure fairness, interested parties are required to set up one node using the instructions on https://edgematrix.pro/start. (Linux/Mac , you don’t need to sync all block heights to test the interface.) After setting up the node, testers should input the node ID on Internet Computer Loading and complete the entire edge node computing test.（https://oregon.edgematrix.xyz is router node for testing）
This will help testers understand EMC’s working principles. Those who submit the test process and their observations will be rewarded with ICP and EMC, and their transaction records will be made public. The first three testers will receive 50 ICP and 5000 EMC each，while the rest will be added to the airdrop list as a token of gratitude for their time.
Testers must deploy an AI application locally that provides a Restful API. The tool is for technical personnel and developers of computing nodes to demonstrate the testing of the node’s computing interface and the process of calling AI computing power from the backend of the application. After the backend application is tested successfully, users can use emc_sdk to rewrite their original way of calling AI computing power, using a more economical decentralized computing power.
To query the node ID, use the following command:
$ ./edge-matrix secrets output --data-dir edge_data
To start the AI computing node, use one of the following commands:
Start in foreground
$./edge-matrix server --chain genesis.json --data-dir ./edge_data --grpc-address 0.0.0.0:50000 --libp2p 0.0.0.0:50001 --jsonrpc 0.0.0.0:50002 --app-url http://: --app-name your_AI_Service_name
The AI computing power service requires a Restful API interface that can be called by the local EMC computing power node.
Deploying an edge computing power node requires a connection to the public network, and there is no need to open ports in the local firewall. The AI service interface of the edge node can be called by any Router Node that provides Rpc services on the EMC network through the P2P protocol.
Additional notes:
The computing power node deployer can customize the idl.json file to facilitate the tool’s recognition of specific key interfaces. The idl.json file needs to be placed in the same directory as edge-matrix executable.
The idl.json configuration file format is as follows:
[
{
“path”: “/sdapi/v1/txt2img”,
“method”: “POST”,
“desc”: “text to image”,
“owner”: “stuble distinction”,
“contentType”: “application/json”,
“rawExample”: “{"enable_hr":false,"denoising_strength":0,"firstphase_width":0,"firstphase_height":0,"hr_scale":2,"hr_upscaler":"","hr_second_pass_steps":0,"hr_resize_x":0,"hr_resize_y":0,"prompt":"white cat and dog","styles":[""],"seed":-1,"subseed":-1,"subseed_strength":0,"seed_resize_from_h":-1,"seed_resize_from_w":-1,"sampler_name":"","batch_size":1,"n_iter":1,"steps":50,"cfg_scale":7,"width":512,"height":512,"restore_faces":false,"tiling":false,"do_not_save_samples":false,"do_not_save_grid":false,"negative_prompt":"","eta":0,"s_churn":0,"s_tmax":0,"s_tmin":0,"s_noise":1,"override_settings":{},"override_settings_restore_afterwards":true,"script_args":,"sampler_index":"Euler","script_name":"","send_images":true,"save_images":false,"alwayson_scripts":{}}”,
“rawDesc”: “body desc”
},
{
“path”: “/sdapi/v1/sd-models”,
“method”: “GET”,
“desc”: “stable diffusion models”,
“owner”: “stuble distinction”,
“contentType”: “application/json”,
“rawExample”: “{}”,
“rawDesc”: “no parameters”
}
]
The idl.json file is not mandatory. The online testing tool will automatically check whether the computing node provides idl.json, and if recognized, it will automatically add the interface described in idl to the Enter Point APIs list of the testing tool for easy testing operations.
I’m glad you have clarified that there is some kind of relationship between the project and Dfinity.
I think that ICP is a welcoming place and but since FTX/ LUNA the crypto space has become very aware of glossy hopium. The lack of visible history is a legitimate concern, however I do note that we are mostly unaware of China social media.
That said… I still think that they are missing any working product?
No one is procrastinating. The EMC team is working more than 14.5 hours per day per person, and dozens of people are completing the workload of hundreds of people. A few VC interviews joined temporarily interrupted some work, but we will make up for it before the weekend.
When I see that dfinity approves a project, I don’t have to worry about it being a rug, I’m sure the dfinity team has already checked, my only concern is how successful the project can be.
chatbox is a decentralized social application developed by a small team and built on the EMC network. It is positioned as a portal for AI applications and it is still early stage and there are not enough nodes in the EMC network to provide enough computing power for it. Only about a few thousand people are currently using it. But chatbox is so promising that it has received funding from EMC. In the next 6 months, the EMC will divert 1 million users to chatbox to help it grow.
This is super interesting, but can you give me an “explain like I’m a dense teenager” of what I’m actually running on my machine? If I understand it well I’m super interested in trying it out.
Yes. Honestly I am very confused. EMC is announcing its intention to SNS as soon as possible, even though the product has not launched yet? That is not how the SNS should be used.
Please tell me if I am misunderstanding something.
I am sharing my personal thought on SNS is for complete products. There are whole lots of different definition on complete product, as a seasoned investor previously working with large PE/VC, the maturity of product certainly go by stages, to be OC is at the very early phase of MVP with early adopter and users on the product, in the old school would probably consider this a pre-A series, as the team has yet to proof the commercialization model (paying user and ARPU) or new user acqusition model generally tie to CAC, the same comment applicable for Hotornot as well. Having said that, we are in this complete new Web3 world, the project teams decided to tokenise and create a DAO at this early stage, yet, I don’t see any operationalize plan and business model taking about how to generate revenue to the platform or just simply a free community tools for everyone to use and monetize through Ad. Without all these, I would definitely not investing my ICP in this DApp, at least at this stage. Pardon me for my way of discription on the following to SAS (no offence to ICP): we shall not turn SNS into a “Pet (DApp) Shop” where we buy the “Pet” and getting all the joy of the companion of our lovely pet and without needing to consider the ROI of our investment, how this DApp will bring in incremental liquidity or user to ICP and hence increase the entire value of ICP ecosystem that result in higher token price. If the DApp is only used in current ICP communities, this is really just a circulation of ICP within current pool.
EMC is an infra, not a dapp. In fact, the product has already been launched, but it is too big to be seen.
Just like when vitalik launched ethereum with smart contracts, someone asked, where is your product
Just tried out running some cat photos using the given link. https://57hlm-riaaa-aaaap-qbhfa-cai.icp0.io/#/api/c2RhcGl2MXR4dDJpbWc
Edit the prompt and styles and execute, the response time is decent. (Compare running with my own GPU)
BTW seems you need to convert the base64 to png yourself.
One question for the team, there is some ‘NSFW’ AIGC too, whats your policy towards that?
Hello @ninadou, thank you for bringing more insight and information to the discussion. There appears to be a possible language/cultural barrier squeezing into this discussion and I want to provide some feedback from someone who doesn’t hold a lot of voting power, but has been watching the crypto space for a long time. My TLDR is below, but if any of the EMC team wants more feedback from a small American retail investor, read on after that.
Feedback for EMC in hopes it can help in the future: I have been scammed, invested in projects that started out great then died, and used the FTX exchange based on almost everyone saying Sam Bankman-Fried was a genius and if you didn’t invest in his projects or listen to him, you were stupid. I thought if everyone else was doing their due diligence and investing in SBF, I should too. Turned out, I was wrong. Now, I do my own research.
With respect to the statement from @zire above, I hope this is helpful. I do not mean to come across angry, condescending, mean, or negative to you or your project. I wish you nothing but success. But I cannot verify the following statements, therefore I personally cannot trust they are true.
Are you talking about the backgrounds listed on the web site? If you’re asking me to trust what you wrote on the web site is true, I’m sorry, I don’t. So, I attempted to dig deeper and verify your team has developed and operated platforms with millions of users. Unfortunately, with only using tools available to the general public, I wasn’t able to verify all of it.
The first was Alexis Zed:
Alexis Zed (I was unable to pin this name to an actual person. Possible nickname instead using actual name?)
Co-founder & CEO
Master of Computational Mathematics , MSU (Is this a United States instituion? Michigan State?)
More than 7 years quantitative trading experience in US stock (Where? At an actual firm?)
Founder of DGame NFT marketplace (I could not find any NFT marketplace called DGame using a simple google search. Is this in another country? Do you have a link, even in another language?)
Next is Alex Goh:
Alex Goh ( I found all of the information below also listed HERE which gave me more confidence in the project. I did not dig deeper.)
Shawn (With just the name “Shawn”, it is impossible to verify anything below, so I cannot believe it is true.)
Technical Partner & CTO
More than 10 years experience in Mobile Internet
Experienced and results-driven Contract Engineer with 15 years of experience in P2P communication
Responsible for the product development of Telecom’s billion-level concurrent large-scale commercial Applications
Next is Ping:
Ping (I was able to find a Twitter profile HERE which is active and mostly referencing Cosmos. Again, this shows there is an actual person attached to this name. I also checked out the Github HERE which is also active and current but unrelated to EMC. This information leads me to believe the below is true, but I did not dig any deeper.)
Blockchain Architect
Founder of Ping.pub
Early developer of Cosmos hub
Award of COSMOS GOS hackathon and space race hackathon
Wanxiang Blockchain Hackathon runner-up
Last was Allen Foo:
Allen Foo (I found the LinkedIn profile HERE which made me confident this was an actual person. I did not dig any deeper.)
Product & Technical Advisor
Founder & CEO of UCCVR Early Stage VC fund and VooX
Formerly Head of Unity Greater China
Formerly Head of Microsoft’s Greater China Server business (included the current Azure Cloud business)
Unfortunately, I did not see any reference to Ksana or EMC, in any of those profiles. A little odd to me if everyone on the team is so sure these projects are going to be the next big thing, but not a huge red flag. Given what I was able to find online, I still find it hard to believe your claim of developing and operating platforms with millions of users. Not that it isn’t true, I was just not able to satisfy the claim with the information I found.
Hello @alxgoh, I would be happy to pay respect to your team of 30 developers if I was easily able to find out who they are. I believe this also may be one of the instances of a cultural and language barrier. To me (an American) the term “bootstrap” means “the process of using only existing resources, such as personal savings, personal computing equipment, and garage space, to start and grow a company”. But as your team has said above, the project started as Ksana back in 2021? And I believe Ksana has received grants and other investments before turning into EMC. It is not a bootstrapped project with respect to the American meaning of that term.
I will not call you, because you can say anything you want. With all due respect, I do not trust you. I need to verify everything with as much factual data from other sources.
If I cannot verify what Sam and the ICP Global R&D team are saying, I won’t trust their statements either, as much as I respect their work. Trusting statements from very smart people in the past has caused me to lose money. I try to avoid that now.
Hi @zed.emc, what is you Twitter handle? I could not find it with my basic search. I love to learn and listen to AMA’s. I think listening to these would go a long way in helping the community build confidence in the project.
I am interested! As I listed above, I was able to find a LinkedIn profile for Allen Foo that has over 500+ connections and is listed as being located in Shanghai. If he can do it, I don’t know why anyone else couldn’t. But, I don’t live in China either. You also said (in a round about way) that you have participated in various AMAs on Twitter, which means you have a Twitter profile?
This is very confusing to me. So, is Ksana now officially EMC? Because when I go to ksana.io, there is no mention (that I could find) of it converting to a new company? I see the Ksana Twitter account paused it’s Tweeting for a few months after November of 2022, and now all it looks like it does is retweet EMC tweets? I’m confused on how the two companies are related? It might benefit you to clarify what is happening to Ksana? From the Ksana white paper, it looks like you generated tokens for Ksana last quarter? Is the Ksana roadmap still valid?
Is it common to ask for funding from grants/token sales/VC’s while building your own project, then give that money to other projects, then ask for more money for your project? The more I read this thread, the more confused I get. That might not be what you’re doing, I am definitely confused though.
Congratulations on your launch. I hope my feedback is at least somewhat useful to you in the future and again, I wish you the best of luck!
Thanks for the offer. I will test this out and report back in a week on the forum. I don’t care about the bounty(ICP/EMC) or AirDrop.
Any documentation will help. Additionally i will be creating my own documentation; which, if necessary, you can use.
As you can probably tell, i am not in awe of names…just working code, decent documentation.
How do i post questions? I don’t wish to use this forum for EMC questions. For example, your instructions on https://edgematrix.pro/start don’t tell me how to install edge-matrix.
There are more questions, so I’ll try to answer them one by one
First of all, because of Chinese policy, there is no legal support for pure web3, so Chinese developers can’t use their real names, which is something any Chinese person knows, but may be difficult for Americans to understand. Alex and Allen are Singaporean nationals, so this is not a problem for them. Secondly, linkedin is forbidden in China, so Chinese developers have no linkedin information unless they work overseas (I tried registering with EMC’s Singapore company, but couldn’t get through, don’t know why).
My twitter: @zedbuho, you can check the ama I participate in, but my English speaking is not good, so basically it’s all Chinese ama I took. And twitter is also banned in China, we need to go through vpn to use it, which is very poor, so actually twitter is not our primary tool either.
Edit-1
That’s fair. I think having an internet identity for different team members and demonstrating sustained communications (over months) in, say, open chat or dscvr might help for folks who need to see individual personalities.
If you are claiming that we should invest in you/EMC, partially because the team has web2 and web3 experience, it is natural for us to “trust but verify”. Either that comes out in personalities, code commits, whatever.
I think having translations into English about AMAs is pretty important. While i don’t speak Chinese, through the use of meta’s new speech-to-text , it might be possible for me to convert your amas into English.
Can you post three ideal AMAs that i can convert to English?
MSU means moscow state university , I got M.S. from the Department of Computational Mathematics（BMuK in Russian） in 2002.
BTW:I don’t like the way you talk, for example (in a round about way), it comes across as insincere and why would I want to incriminate myself. If you had preconceived notions from the beginning, why should I prove myself innocent. I am a very strong person and I don’t care if you believe me or not. I don’t want to emphasize that this is a common American problem, which seems to involve ethnic tensions. So unless you apologize first, I won’t continue.
Hmmm…to be fair, Alex did invite jwarner to do his diligence and call him if necessary. Jwarner declined that offer. There was no particular motive that i saw in that decline ; except for jwarner’s belief.
I think that you’re doing yourself a disservice. I feel that you think people are being personal to you and your team. By the tone of jwarner’s email, i think that you could have just taken him at his word. He simply believes that Alex might say anything…he wants to use other means to verify. Recognizing that different folks come from different perspectives is pretty important; especially in a diverse community like ICP, IMO
