What happened to “trustless”?
This is the most fundamental component of web3 - which seems to be missed by some in this discussion.
Here is the most accurate visualization of WTN’s distribution
[🍉 WaterNeuron decentralization]
It’s some kind of art form - how they managed to put only ~20% of the ICP and get 64% of the control. Then use everyone’s ICP to bribe other people through nICP to vote for them against the ones who funded it. Additionally, collecting ICP from SNSes that are partially coming from the NF.
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You should update this to reflect bity.
Since bity is the gold dao team wouldn’t that mean in total dev neurons and whale are at about 45% vp.
I’ll add the images so you can see where you went wrong in the initial analysis of wallets.
I should also highlight that these neurons are all individually owned and vote how they want. It is not one person controlling all these neurons.
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Agreed.
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It’s pretty clear that gold dao would have to be part of a 51% attack and collude to take down the network to fit their threat vector theory.
I wonder why they aren’t asking for the gold dao team’s opinion on this subject.
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Btw just to make it easier for those wondering who the 5 neurons are in that nakamoto coefficient here is the screen shot.
You can see gold dao would have to collude with the one whale and dev team.
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yes sorry in my thinking I should have said 3 parties not 3 accounts. those 3 parties I consider to be.
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“The Dev Team” (I understand they have separate accounts, but I considered them to be an aligned party.)
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Bity / gold dao
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“Whale 1”
It is important to note that “data” can be used to tell whatever story someone wants to tell. But I’m glad we’re presenting real things now.
As I have said numerous times, I don’t personally believe any parties have ill-intent. Only that in the future their interests are likely to be aligned with eachother, and may be not aligned with the nICP holders whose votes they are levaraging. And certainly not aligned with the other WTN holders whose voting power they effectively control.
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The dev team from my understanding is 2-3 people while there are accounts labeled as “dev neurons” in infus data set that are just early contributors to the protocol.
I would hesitate to assume all infus dev neuron accounts are accurate in this 51% discussion.
Then every nICP holder has to assume that a shadowy cabal controls their vote. That’s the assumption you have to make.
That’s why we need a better solution to liquid staking.
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Is gold dao now a part of this shadow cabal?
BTW no one is forcing anyone to stake for nicp. Users have freedom to choose. Go create your staking solution already so you can stop the witch hunt against other devs and daos.
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This is big facts.
If you dont like WTN, or you feel like your vote doesnt count. The proper way to express that is to dump WTN and dump nICP.
The problem is you have to convince everyone else to do this too and both WTN and nICP are lucrative propositions (at the expense of everyone else.) value is not being created here, its being extracted.
Why would Gold DAO want to be part of your shadow cabal?
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You and I do not agree on the “at the expense of everyone else” part.
Other than that its free choice for users to either stake on the nns or with wtn. DYOR and make the best choice for yourself.
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They are needed for this 51% collusion you warn everyone about.
Where does the value come from then?
If have a normal commercial application with users who are receiving a service and making micropayments to subsidize their use, and this value is transferred to the owners, that service was a created value. The net effect on the network is icp is burned, benefitting all holders.
WTN is just a money printer, where users use a clever circumvention of icps fundamental architecture to retain their liquidity while their icp is gaining yield. The net effect on the network is inflation, more icp, harming all holders, disproportionately harming those that did not participate.
It was described to me yesterday as follows: With nIPC you are swapping your vote for additional rewards. Your are quite literally selling out.
You constantly ignore the fact that all nicp represent icp being staked and locked in a 6month neuron.
Nicp is essentially setting a follower relationship if you were staking in the nns.
If that is viewed as selling out then your perspective is correct.