Can someone explain more about the yield when buying cICP instead of just staking in the SNS with ICP?
I like the idea of NTN getting into the NP business and the community actually owning nodes but at the end of the day small investors look at the ROI.
The community wonât own any nodes. They will just fund ntn getting nodes and will get the node rewards in return.
But for you to earn any apy on cicp you have to sell on the market. You canât ever unstake the icp you put in.
I do realise it is a grey area of actually owning nodes bu the community, someones name needs to be on the dotted line but everything can be done transparent and that is were people trust a DAO or not.
As for the APY only being realised when selling that is ok, thatâs how most Defi projects work with yield. You only get the accrued APY rewards when unstaking and in this case selling.
But, why would people buy cICP over staking with ICP on the NNS directly where you get 14%ish when locking 8 year. (besides cICP being liquid of course)
Are there any forecasts? How much will someone get if he buys 100 ICP worth of cICP for 1 year for example?
@dimey78
NP rewards, is that already coded or is this a roadmap idea?
The difference is this relies on game theory. You have to be early to sell to get the apy or whales can take your earned maturity.
Forcing you to wait even longer to get any apy.
Yes, think of the APY going inside the coin, and you can take it out when you sell.
It will definitely be above 8y neuron voting rewards. But it can be much more than that. Depends on DeFi activity, liquidity added with cICP, ICP/USD price, node rewards, ICP/cICP price action, and cICP ledger transactions burn. Itâs theoretically possible to reach even 100% and above (not likely tho).
Whales canât take out your maturity; they will be taking the liquidity in DEXes, which belongs to whoever placed it there. If you sell early at bad rates, you are just going to be increasing the APY of everyone else holding cICP, if nobody else buys it right away. With vectors, LPs can provide liquidity over time automatically, so itâs not all available for the first one who hits sell.
Thanks for the added info. 
Will users be able to see on the dashboard how much they have accumulated already? (even if it is a rough estimate)
Do you have a timeline/deadline on node and node rewards? This, for me, would be the main reason to invest in cICP. 
Okay, so maybe I am misunderstanding something here.
Is the liquidity in the dex not representative of the maturity being made from the 8yr neuron?
@dimey78 hey could you explain to everyone how ntn dao isnât a security assumption for cicp?
From my understanding ntn governs the cicp protocol meaning they can change anything at anytime with out the voice of cicp users.
I understand they use open source protocols to help run some of the project but in the end if one wallet can change everything does that pose a centralized security risk for cicp users?
But it does mean anything being put under the sns dao(ntn) is centralized and suffers similar risks as any other sns.
Similar to how you can build and replicate wtn/nicp with their open source code?
There isnât much needed to code around nodes. Node RWAs will be vectors where the controller for cICP nodes will be Neutrinite DAO. The reward destination gets set to the same buyback vector icrc address, it swaps ICP for cICP and burns it.
Users can track their accumulated gains by comparing the current mint rate with the rate at which they originally received cICP. However, displaying this on a per-user basis isnât practical, as users may have acquired cICP across multiple days at varying rates.
Finally people realizing that Borovan gang is the Swamp.
ICP has a problem, node providers need to sell, same with Dfinity, all big stakers sell (Borovan included). This generates stable sell pressure what is well used by market makers. Keep in mind that even people who open long positions will move money out of ICP, that is if they make any money. So, best strategy is to wait for longs to pile up, wait some news, short, dump on spot, liquidate longs, buy low on spot, repeat. This wont change until institutional investors come in, but will they, no, they stuck on other crypto projects. If ICP moons, they will lose lot more with other projects than with what they can make on ICP. People need to understand that ICP might not go over 30 usd unless its bottom will be somewhere 1-2 usd. All those hypers will hurt ICP, but they dont even realize it.
About Borovan cICP, its a pyramide sceme where He has 80-90% VP, this does not benefit ICP in any way, only increases sell pressure and will make more money for hes gang.
Like I said ntn controls the vote and is just like wtn rn.
As well as it forces users to follow other known neurons instead of voting independently on proposals which is giving their vp to other people and not giving it to the stakers.
And if users donât set a follower they default give their vp right back to ntn.
Itâs similar to nicp but with nicp users know up front their vp will be used by the wtn dao.
Soon with yusan.fi, youâd be able to borrow against your ICP, and use the USDC either on the IC or other chains thanks to onesec.to.
Gratz on the new protocols. I think you are pretty great devs, just not a fan of your business department decisions
Or you donât want to admit cicp is more centralized than the protocol you were paid to fud.
Have you thought about people doing otc deals? And or people just transferring cicp to someone for a vote or two? Similar to bribes?
cicp users donât actually get to vote but they have to follow someone. This 8 yr vp with out actual voting rights is dangerous. As well as how much more liquid this vp is vs having ntn just control the vp.
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When you transfer cICP to someone, you transfer the stake and the voting power. Itâs pretty much the same as transferring ICP before staking it. When you transfer WTN, you only transfer the voting power without the stake.
@Mico @EpicICP You should come with at least half-decent arguments if you want to argue. Your posts make you look like influencers chasing attention. If you havenât noticed, the cabal that sponsored you is in a ceasefire with us. Weâre all back to building - you influencers can go use your skills to, I dunno, shill ICP on Solana and Base or something. You arenât going to get more than a forum ban if you keep posting just to annoy.
I posted a thorough analysis of cICP when it was first launched on Twitter and the WaterNeuron forums. I have no intention to argue with you about cICP, because I donât believe it would produce any positive outcome.
You should know by now that there is no cabal and I am not sponsored by anyone.
And if you want to ignore that actual issues with creating a liquid vp masked as staking then so be it. Try not to hide behind conspiracy to avoid real vulnerabilities in your product though.
