Remove cycle dao named neuron

I think renaming the neuron might confuse and scare a lot of people. I can already see the posts; “my neuron suddenly started following some guy Arthur, have I been hacked??!?”. Then you explain your renamed it and it all becomes a problem.

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Almost. I propose to do #2 and never do #1 as this is roughly the same effort but covers more functionality.
Let me try to express this in the same style…

Add removing functionality

  • Once it is done, submit NNS proposal to remove Cycle DAO. Let’s assume the Cycle DAO neuron has neuronID 12345
  • This keeps following relationships and neuron history and community. That is, neuron 12345 still exists, everyone that followed it will still follow it. The only difference is that neuron 12345 will not be displayed in the FE list of known neurons.
  • submit NNS proposal to add neuron 12345 with the name “Arthur”. Everyone that followed CycleDao will now follow Arthur. Arthur is shown as the name of neuron 12345 in the frontend.

If I now follow CycleDao it might be that there is a brief moment between the second and third point where I would see my neurons follow 12345 because the neuron has no name.

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Depending on how things are implemented this might also happen in my suggestion where one could remove a neuron and add it again with another name… But I think this is something that would have to be clarified with the frontend team (I would have to double check how a neuron’s name is relevant when you already follow it).

But we seem to agree that a removing proposal might be favourable over a rename proposal.

This is probably way more code but maybe we should remove neuron and next time they login prompt them. “Hey a neuron has been removed because reasons so you have to pick a new neuron to follow. “

Deleting the list of oligarchs is the correct choice. Why do neurons in an oligopoly list get voting power more easily than others? Why oligarchic lists can manipulate voting to achieve self-censorship.

Because passive staking is important for the growth of the protocol

@dfinity You design rules where you have to vote to get rewards, then send hundreds of daily maintenance proposals every day. You also say that the focus on oligarchs is because users trust public nerves. Do users have other options besides following you? Can you vote on dozens of subnet upgrade proposals and 144 exchange rate proposals every day? Do users have other options than following oligarchic lists? The same goes for the motion proposal, DFINITY puts public neurons in front of NNS, they get votes more easily than others, they just form an interest group that can self-censor. If IC is a public blockchain, it should belong to all stakers. Is the oligarch list fair to the voting rights of other stakers? Is this how you treat the voting rights of other stakers?(I don’t know exactly who designed it, so tag dfinity here)

Will More Named Neurons Change It’s a Self-Censore(control Voting resultsl) Interest Group(Easy access to voting weight)?

You guys didn’t even devise a basic requirement to join the oligarch list, it’s entirely up to them to self-censor at will。
It was there when I first got my hands on IC last year, when it was only dfinity and ICA

Wow this really went off the rails quick. Oligarchs?

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good point. I agree.

This makes sense @lara . thanks for clarifying! I like your thinking.

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seems like it
Oligarchy (Ancient Greek: ὀλιγαρχία) is a form of politics in which much or all is effectively in the hands of a few privileged classes (whether wealth, family, military power, brutality, or politics). --wiki

I just thought I should help clarify a potential point that is ambiguous:

A NNS Frontend dapp user can follow ANY neuron. For example, Manu Drijver’s neuron is on his Twitter profile: 8191637969740243463. Some neurons follow neurons that are not “named”. “Named neuron” is just for the the list in the UX, but you can input any neuron to follow

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Does he manually vote on each exchange rate proposal?

Of course I know it is possible to follow the neuron id

Oh sorry, I apologize. I presumed incorrectly. I thought you may not be aware. However, I still think many people are not aware (from my personal experience), so i thought it would be good for readers of this thread.

Your experience further illustrates the shortcomings of oligarchic lists

An uninformed user can only be randomly selected from the list of oligarchs

I do not know why you keep saying “oligarchic” lists, i guarantee you there are neurons that will have MUCH more voting power that @cryptoisgood 's neuron will have :wink:

Being a named neurons is just a neuron having a name.

My experience of people not being aware they can input any neuron ID is honestly an UX/design issue to make it more obvious for users in the dapp. I am not sure it is a consequence of the list, but I am willing to concede I am missing some nuance you are getting at.

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